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Wednesday, April 19, 2017

The only reasonable position

It's well known that fence sitters are cowardly, but their intrinsic dishonesty in equating both sides is arguably more contemptuous. Stephen Miller demonstrates the noble moderation of the moderate as he refuses to take sides when forced to choose between antifa and Alt-Right:
This past weekend our great nation once again sat back and rooted for injuries on the far ends of both sides of the political spectrum, as Tax Day protestors clashed with pro-Trump supporters in theda Starbucks-ridden, gentrified urban wastelands of Berkeley, again.

Your challengers? On the left: the black-masked, hoodie-clad, spoke-roach brigade of “Antifa”: a far left, anarchist, communist “whateverist” campus movement hellbent on proving Trump right about everything. On the right: Alt-Right memelord weekend warrior Trump supporters in batting cage helmets and American flag capes, arriving to do battle, while most likely lying to their wives that they were just stepping out to Home Depot for a bit.

Fists were thrown; America’s leading Mindset Expert was gently fondled; tear gas was dispersed and Pepsi offered. News helicopters captured footage of Antifa and the Pepe Army playing Red Rover with what must have been a super-entitled dumpster that needed to check its privilege.
The noble sirs always attempt to portray their fecklessness as Olympian discernment. In truth, they're simply dishonest cowards who feel safest when attacking from behind.

Labels: ,

120 Comments:

Blogger pyrrhus April 19, 2017 12:59 PM  

Per Anthony Burgess's main character in Tremor of Intent, neutrals always get in the neck from both sides in the end.

Blogger Matthew McDaniel April 19, 2017 1:00 PM  

This article sucks. No mention of Based Ric Flair knocking commie skulls around.

Blogger dc.sunsets April 19, 2017 1:04 PM  

Fence-sitters inevitably get either hemorrhoids or impalement.

Blogger Cluebat Vanexodar April 19, 2017 1:05 PM  

Agree 100%.

Wish I could contribute more to the defenders of our heritage against the slavering nihilistas. If it comes to my neighborhood I will help organize.

Anonymous DissidentRight April 19, 2017 1:06 PM  

It's becoming very easy to understand why moderates and centrists who refuse to commit can end up much worse off than partisans.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan April 19, 2017 1:14 PM  

Can we get antifa onto the Ivies' campuses?

Anonymous Faceless April 19, 2017 1:14 PM  

"Healthcare? Antifa college activists fall in line right behind Grandpa Bernie Sanders in advocating universal government paid healthcare for all…which happens to be the exact same position taken by Donald Trump (both during the campaign, and after the AHCA fallout). This has been known as far back as 2015. Several “thought leaders” of the new alt right endorse single payer healthcare as well."


Well, the GOP is for Obamacare. I am confused as to how this is a major issue now, since it has entered fait accompli. It is a government program, and Republicans NEVER repeal government programs. The Congressional GOP found something wrong with the idea of repeal, otherwise, there would have been a bill already.

Whose side is this guy actual on - the pretend principles NeverTrump alliance? Does he also get the vapors about 10 year old remarks and see Russians hidden behind trees and rocks?

Anonymous Faceless April 19, 2017 1:17 PM  

This proves that Heat Street is a brown stain on the carpet even without Louise Mensch's inane ramblings about being an uber feminist anti-Christian pro-gay "conservative". Everything the Murdoch boys touch turns to rubbish.

Blogger Frank Gappa April 19, 2017 1:18 PM  

I have to admit the comment about Cernovich "America's leading mindset expert" was pretty funny.

Anonymous swede April 19, 2017 1:19 PM  

I got confused by the author sharing a name with one of Trump's speech writers, but it's just some random never-trumper who gets off on being confused with him.

Blogger Mr.MantraMan April 19, 2017 1:21 PM  

We got Moldylocks out of this though, a lost child of upper class suburbia turned into Meth addicted Martyr. If Moldylocks plays it right she could easily displace whacky Louise.

Blogger Shimshon April 19, 2017 1:21 PM  

"Antifa manifests their anti-speech authoritarianism on college campuses against speakers they don’t like (or whoever the groups they follow on Facebook tell them not to like). The alt-right attempts to bury anyone online who dares speak out against their God-Emperor on social media..."

Did he just equate physical violence with meme trolling? Please tell me this isn't Trump's adviser.

Blogger JaimeInTexas April 19, 2017 1:22 PM  

One small punch for a man, one giant strike for women's equality.

https://twitter.com/NYCAntifa/status/853382912099614720

Anonymous Faceless April 19, 2017 1:22 PM  

@10

Oh, it's that jackass. "Redsteeze" became the personification of hate at some point during the election, and will never not hate Trump and Trump supporters. He may be battier than Louise. I'm sure Twitchy will say his column is great and he got in a "sick burn" on the Pro-Trump supporters...you know, what they used to call the Republican Base.

Blogger lowercaseb April 19, 2017 1:23 PM  

Thank you for this. As an ex-moderate I noticed a real life example of the place where moderates could be useful.

When we were going up the street, Antifa yanked a fence from a construction site out into the road to slow the advance. The front lines bashed it down and continued after them. There were people working in the buildings there and were watching worried from the glass.

A few of us that were not smashing the front line (I had no stamina...that will get corrected), grabbed the fence, dragged it out of the street and put it back up and gave the thumbs up to the folks in the office building.

Up at the corner, traffic was backed up were Antifa crossed and threw garbage and cans out into the road. A few folks that were too slow to keep up with the front line, cleared the trash from the road and one hero stepped up and started directing traffic so that it could get moving again.

A useful moderate calms the folks that are non-combatants and puts things right so that society can keep moving. Stuff that the folks on the front line can not focus on because they are focused on pushing the enemy back. A useful moderate shows the normal folks that we are not just street fighters.

Unfortunately, moderates nowadays actively get in the way. In the above example they would be yelling "Don't smash that barricade down, that makes you no better than them."

They are the ones yelling "No violence" holding you back and getting you sucker punched because you are distracted and unable to defend yourself.

Stephan Miller is not a moderate. He is full on cuck. He's the guy who would be yelling "Sure the picture of Iwo Jima is inspiring, but did those troops really have to use flamethrowers? That makes us no better than the Japanese."

Blogger Rabbi B April 19, 2017 1:28 PM  

They don't have the stomach for the arena. Self-serving, spineless cowards who want the accolades without risking anything. Saving face is all that matters. There couldn't be a more useless class of people.

Anonymous A Most Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents April 19, 2017 1:30 PM  

Nice sneering, even for Heat Street. As Mike Tyson might say, everyone has a nice sneer until they get punched in the face.

Blogger Cataline Sergius April 19, 2017 1:31 PM  

Prepare yourself for a devastating shock. The National Review's view wasn't any different.

If you are fighting for freedom of speech and freedom of assembly then you are clearly and obviously members of the SA.

The Berkley Riot has shown just how completely cucked the Conservative movement has become. They reflexively adopted the Media Narrative, just like they've been doing since Bill Buckley's day. To hear the Conservative's tell it. Anyone who steps up and is willing to actually fight for and take damage in defending Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Assembly is a Nazi. Apparently if you want these basic American rights defended, you are permitted only to bleat like frightened sheep for the Proper Authorities to Do Something! And hope that any Amenable sheep dog that takes an interest, won't bite you too badly for having spoken up.

Whether it's effete squeamishness or veiled cowardice, I simply don't care anymore. They can not lead. They do not follow. And they won't get out of the way. The Conservatives are simply a useless obstruction at this point.

Anonymous 5343 Kinds of Deplorable April 19, 2017 1:32 PM  

Please tell me this isn't Trump's adviser.

This isn't Trump's adviser.

Blogger lowercaseb April 19, 2017 1:35 PM  

@18 Wow! I have yet another site to add to my morning reads. Well said!

Blogger Cail Corishev April 19, 2017 1:36 PM  

Alt-Right memelord weekend warrior

He has to say "weekend warrior" because people showed up in person, but he's still hanging onto "memelord," the whole point of which as an insult is to imply that's all someone does. A week ago it would have been "memelord keyboard warriors." Needs a better vocabulary update.

Anonymous VFM #7916 April 19, 2017 1:36 PM  

In the end, they want to win without risk.

They figure they can jump to whatever side wins. This will tell you whether or not they are a reliable ally and whose opinion you can give weight to.

Cernovich and Throne? Yes.
True Leftists? Yep. I'll believe they mean what they say.
The Kristols of the world? Not so much.

Blogger Zundfolge April 19, 2017 1:42 PM  

The problem with many of these people is that they take a reasonable position (that is that one needs to know what's going on before they can take a position) and then expect people to take their inability to make a decision as some form of higher morality.

Fence sitters are stuck between the second O and the D of an OODA loop, this is not a morally superior position, this is the result of a defective mind.

Time to decide and act, fence sitters, or you will be shot down. The old saying goes that those in the middle of the road are most at risk of being run over.

Blogger Cail Corishev April 19, 2017 1:43 PM  

I have to admit the comment about Cernovich "America's leading mindset expert" was pretty funny.

I chuckled. But you'll note that he made no effort to single out any individual on the left for similar ridicule. That might be hurtful and unfair. One thing you can always count on from the moderate or cuckservative: even when trying to look balanced, he will take more jabs right than left.

One word to sum up that article: gay.

Anonymous Reenay April 19, 2017 1:49 PM  

@15 lowercaseb:
What you describe isn't a moderate, but a supporting role. Like the soldiers in Afghanistan whose job was to mend the busted up huts, build schools, and ensure that women could vote (a mistake, that last one). They're the ones responsible for doing the "winning hearts and minds" thing.

Moderates, in contrast, are dumb fucks and cowards that can't make up their mind which side of the fence they should be standing on before it gets knocked down with them on top of it. In the Afghanistan analogy, they're the quislings who refused to support the American soldiers or the Taliban and would spit on the American soldiers for going to war.

And last I recall, these were viewed with much disgust by the general public. If it had been an existential war of survival for us, they would have been killed.

Blogger tz April 19, 2017 1:49 PM  

It is one thing to stand thwart history doing something, anything, it another to sit safely ensconsed in your segre-gated community, typing "Stop!".
After "winning" the cold war, I can't think of a single Communist policy they actively or effectively opposed.

Anonymous basementhomebrewer April 19, 2017 1:51 PM  

Rabbi B wrote:They don't have the stomach for the arena. Self-serving, spineless cowards who want the accolades without risking anything. Saving face is all that matters. There couldn't be a more useless class of people.

They likely have never been in a similar situation either. They always seem to have all the answers about what should be done but they don't have an answer for the question "What if you showed up to give a speech, the police refused to protect you and the left showed up to seriously hurt you." Their answer is always something like "I am too smart to put myself in a situation like that".

If it does happen to them they tend to shriek, run and hide and then tell everyone about their new found victimhood. Anyone with a brain knows that does nothing to protect free speech or advance our cause.

Blogger tz April 19, 2017 1:52 PM  

Another term for Moderate might be pacifist. Lewis had an essay (on CS Lewis Doodle) why I am NOT a pacifist. It was one thing to be drafted and become a medic or go into the peace corps, but a different one entirely to stay out and subvert those fighting the enemy. Sometimes wars are imprudent, but pacifism is the passive aggressive version of the traitor.
Wormtongue wasn't even willing to stab or actually poison Theoden, he could only do a whisper campaign.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 19, 2017 1:56 PM  

Apparently if you want these basic American rights defended, you are permitted only to bleat like frightened sheep for the Proper Authorities to Do Something!
In my experience this is how American Jews handle disputes. Call a cop, file a lawsuit, kvetch and moan. It hardly surprising that NRO and their pet Whites like Williamson would take the same approach.

OT, but has anybody else noticed that when Christian morality and Jewish morality come into conflict, that one side consistently gets the laws changed to reflect their own side?
Divorce
Abortion
Porn
Everything.

Blogger S. Misanthrope April 19, 2017 1:57 PM  

1. There were no Tax Day protesters, just Antifa coming to stop our Freedom Rally.
2. The wives were there, too, asshole.

REEEEEEE!

Blogger Cail Corishev April 19, 2017 1:58 PM  

@15, lowercaseb:

With all due respect (and seriously, massive respect for being on the front lines), that's not what we mean by "moderate" around here. It doesn't just mean someone who's less fanatical than others on the same side. A moderate is someone who always takes the stance of, "Well, both sides have some good points, and they could get along if they'd just be as reasonable as I am." A moderate couldn't have been cleaning up behind you as you marched, because a moderate would never have been on your side in the first place. He would be standing between the two groups, telling the Right that they need to be kinder and more understanding of the Left's feelings so everyone can get along -- or more likely he'd be many miles away writing a sneering, condescending article like the one linked here.

Really, the only difference between a moderate and a cuckservative is that the cuckservative claims to be conservative, while the moderate will more often claim to be independent.

Anonymous a deplorable rubberducky April 19, 2017 1:59 PM  

Noble sir rhetoric like this serves to blunt efforts to upend the status quo, thereby defending the SJWs (but of course). Pox upon these guys.

Anonymous Eduardo April 19, 2017 2:05 PM  

Actually I think the reason the moderate jabs so much right is that the moderates believe in either, non-exclusive, things:

1. The moderate believes that his higher morals and rational enquiry skills is what will hand him the victory over the Left, the Alt-Right or any "extreme" Right-Wing ideologies don't share their sense of morality and therefore it is bound to end in shit just like any Left ideology.

2. The moderate sees society through the lenses of the Left, he perceives himself as a deviant, someone outside the mainstream. He, the moderate, is the true Extremist! His ideas are on the Edge of the acceptable and anything more Right-Wing is complete insanity. He played the Leftist Maze and found the route that, within the maze, takes furthest to the Right.

-----------------------------------

Darude - Sandstorm!!! Oh no I feel like dancing O_O'

Voyage Voyage!!!! VOYAGE!!!!

I shouldn't post listening to Dance music...

Blogger FALPhil April 19, 2017 2:06 PM  

When I read Stephen Miller's opinion this morning, I came away with the impression that he was truly clueless and ignorant to the point that he couldn't have been being dishonest.

Maybe I was wrong.

Blogger praetorian April 19, 2017 2:08 PM  

while most likely lying to their wives that they were just stepping out to Home Depot for a bit.

That's an strangely specific charge, Stephen.

Blogger Ez April 19, 2017 2:09 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents April 19, 2017 2:10 PM  

@31 cail corishev to lowercaseb
A moderate is someone who always takes the stance of, "Well, both sides have some good points, and they could get along if they'd just be as reasonable as I am."

"If only you two would sit down and have a beer together" is a phrase that I've come to loath. Not just because of 0bama's "beer summit", either.

Blogger Ez April 19, 2017 2:12 PM  

I have sympathy for the fence sitters as I have the hardest time coming to any conclusion about things where I don't feel like I have enough information (which is pretty much everything). I can (and do) take hard line positions when it comes to things like child rearing and homeschooling, but I'm probably not unique among women in that regard.

But the lesson I'm getting is history doesn't belong to the people who don't pick a side, and it doesn't matter if you can dialectically parse everything from different perspectives, you have to choose a rhetorical side or it will be chosen for you.

Blogger Lucas April 19, 2017 2:19 PM  

Oh, he is so superior

Blogger JaimeInTexas April 19, 2017 2:20 PM  

I am all for a beer summit but keep an eye for the empty bottles. What they mean by recycling may not necessarily match ours.

Better to drink with our own.

Blogger lowercaseb April 19, 2017 2:22 PM  

Cail Corishev wrote:With all due respect (and seriously, massive respect for being on the front lines), that's not what we mean by "moderate" around here.

No problem at all...You and @25 are correct. It is a support role rather than a moderate.

I have been wrong about a LOT of things and I have no problem with being corrected and educated.

As a matter of fact without my ideas being challenged, I wouldn't have been there in the first place. I would have been one of those "well both sides are wrong" idiots.

If a time machine is ever built...someone please hold me back when I giving my younger self a boot party.

Anonymous 5343 Kinds of Deplorable April 19, 2017 2:24 PM  

Entirely OT: I love love LOVE the main headline at Infogalactic News, and especially the subhead. This is why we needed our own news aggregator. Give them MOAR MONEY!!!

Blogger FALPhil April 19, 2017 2:25 PM  

@6 Mr. MantraMan asked:
Can we get antifa onto the Ivies' campuses?


Sure. Join up and become an agent provocateur. Since SJWs are committing all sorts of fake 'hate' crimes, I think it would be a viable counter-tactic. It's just a question of time before one of them attempts it with us, so we might as well beat them to the punch. Of course, I think we're smart enough to see through any such attempt, but I don't think they are, at least from what I have seen.

Blogger Dire Badger April 19, 2017 2:29 PM  

Ez- No one expects a woman to pick a side. You are loot, not warrior.

Our disgust lies with men that refuse to behave like men. This is not only logical, but it is wired into our very genes... men that refuse to behave like men are evil, and should be distrusted, because while we men are out hunting animals and competing for position, they remain behind pretending to be women and then fsck our wives and steal our possessions while we are not around.

Fence sitters are worse even than the ones that THINK they are women... because while the mentally kludged are devious thieves, they won't steal our women... the 'moderates' are the ones that are determined to clean up after us, scavenging putty and raiding the tents of the newly deceased.

Blogger lowercaseb April 19, 2017 2:29 PM  

when I giving my younger self a boot party.

I should also remind my younger self to pay attention to third grade English class when we covered sentence structure.

Anonymous Grayman April 19, 2017 2:32 PM  

@37

That is what dueling was for... bring it back.

Anonymous Siobhan April 19, 2017 2:38 PM  

I thought they meant Carol Dweck at first and was exceedingly confused.

Anonymous Deplorable Winning April 19, 2017 2:40 PM  

5343 Kinds of Deplorable wrote:Entirely OT: I love love LOVE the main headline at Infogalactic News, and especially the subhead. This is why we needed our own news aggregator. Give them MOAR MONEY!!!


http://news.infogalactic.com/

First Dreamer Deported
(He Had to Go Back)

Blogger daddynichol April 19, 2017 2:44 PM  

This comment has been removed by the author.

Anonymous BBGKB April 19, 2017 2:44 PM  

Tax Day protesters

Does anyone honestly believe antifa pay more in taxes than they get in taxpayer paid handouts?
I include the $20 billion given to bankers to not loan money as part of those handouts.
https://mishtalk.com/2017/04/17/free-money/

American flag capes, arriving to do battle, while most likely lying to their wives that they were just stepping out to Home Depot for a bit

What happens at the Home Depot Stays at the Home Depot.

"If only you two would sit down and have a beer together"

I think the empty glass bottles Moldylocks was tossing were beer bottles.

Blogger daddynichol April 19, 2017 2:45 PM  

Mr.MantraMan wrote:We got Moldylocks out of this though, a lost child of upper class suburbia turned into Meth addicted Martyr. If Moldylocks plays it right she could easily displace whacky Louise.

But she will never replace our beloved Trigglypuff

Blogger Nate April 19, 2017 2:49 PM  

Pepe Army.

I have no problem with that moniker.

Anonymous VFM #6303 April 19, 2017 2:55 PM  

daddynichol wrote:Mr.MantraMan wrote:We got Moldylocks out of this though, a lost child of upper class suburbia turned into Meth addicted Martyr. If Moldylocks plays it right she could easily displace whacky Louise.

But she will never replace our beloved Trigglypuff


Oh, give her about 18 months and a room stocked with Cheetos.

Blogger Cloudswrest April 19, 2017 2:57 PM  

FYI, "this" Stephen Miller is different from Trumps adviser. https://www.washingtonian.com/2016/09/19/stephen-miller-blogger-mistaken-for-trump-adviser/

Blogger Lex Corvus April 19, 2017 2:58 PM  

As an aside, I love how effectively Mike Cernovich has trolled his haters into spreading his brand. En route to mocking Cernovich, Miller describes him as "America’s leading Mindset Expert." With mockery like that, who needs praise?

Blogger ace April 19, 2017 3:15 PM  

@55 I can imagine people seeing that and going 'what's a 'mindset expert' and why would anyone need one?' At which point MC's job is half done. It really is just an SEO algo for Cernovich the masculine self-help guru.

Blogger Elocutioner April 19, 2017 3:15 PM  

The irony of a nevertrump cuck who takes a paycheck from Cuck Cuckerson telling us to be reasonable and reach out to the other side. The cucks had their chance and failed.

Blogger daddynichol April 19, 2017 3:20 PM  

Revelation 3:16 pretty much sums up the value of fence riders.

Anonymous Charlie April 19, 2017 3:28 PM  

Moderates were always lefty assholes in disguise.

Blogger Jill April 19, 2017 3:33 PM  

This is why I unfollowed Never Trumpers and not progs on Twitter. I couldn't stomach the moralizing. It's one thing to be able to take a philosophical view of various viewpoints, and another to take a stand when it matters.

Blogger Jill April 19, 2017 3:33 PM  

This is why I unfollowed Never Trumpers and not progs on Twitter. I couldn't stomach the moralizing. It's one thing to be able to take a philosophical view of various viewpoints, and another to take a stand when it matters.

Anonymous Mojo Jojo April 19, 2017 3:42 PM  

"Alt-Right memelord weekend warrior Trump supporters"

That's perfect. And it's perfectly reasonable to say you are both idiots.

Anonymous Red Cabbage April 19, 2017 3:53 PM  

Another moderate woman here. Well, I like reading Vox, so not THAT moderate.

I'm pretty sure that integration is against my interests, but I'm still for it. Mostly because I know so many blacks and native Americans whose ancestors have been here as long as mine have. (I'm your typical American white chick: English, Irish, smattering of indigenous.)

How can I advocate kicking them out? Where would they go?

Blogger Nate April 19, 2017 4:08 PM  

"How can I advocate kicking them out? Where would they go?"

it is deeply disturbing to the alt-white... but they will not be kicked out. They cannot be kicked.

What is more likely is large scale segregation... which over time... a long time... eventually leads fairly homogenous regions of the country.

Anonymous Angela De Muerte April 19, 2017 4:13 PM  

@63 They are going to Gibsmedats Paradise Island. They have to take the magic bullet ride to get there, though.

Blogger Nate April 19, 2017 4:21 PM  

" Gibsmedats Paradise Island. "

just remember sugar... if you want to see real gibsmedats... mention social security or medicare.

What's the matter?

is it only gibsmedats when other people do it?

Blogger Were-Puppy April 19, 2017 4:21 PM  

The only people I see equating them on twitter appear to be old boomer grey head women.

This article writer thinks like an OBGHW

Blogger Were-Puppy April 19, 2017 4:22 PM  

Here's an interview Brittany Pettibone interviews #BasedStickman about the Battle of Berkely 3.0

https://youtu.be/KcdWdb4Ziv4

Blogger Were-Puppy April 19, 2017 4:28 PM  

@15 lowercaseb

A useful moderate calms the folks that are non-combatants and puts things right so that society can keep moving.
---

That's not being a moderate, that's being slow for dinner :P

But I agree. Having a lot of people to smooth out the craziness helps morale and observers might think twice about what is going on.

Anonymous Red Cabbage April 19, 2017 4:28 PM  

@64 Thanks for taking my question seriously.

Living near one of the World's Whitest Cities (TM) I have noticed that lots of white people are moving here from Chicago, Baltimore, LA, etc. because the city is "so cool." They talk about how progressive it is, about the art, the music, the nice scenery... sometimes they talk about the lower crime... they complain about the high rent... but few will mention the whiteness.

However, for the same reason, lots of people of color move here too... because it's a nice place to live. I'm not convinced that we'll naturally segregate.

What I'm trying to figure out is how the Alt-Right position could work out in the USA without some sort of exterminatory bloodbath.

Blogger Antony April 19, 2017 4:29 PM  

Interesting vid of punched antifa girl advocating explosives ; https://www.facebook.com/SaveLibertyOrDie/videos/1167532803373506/?hc_ref=PAGES_TIMELINE

Blogger Were-Puppy April 19, 2017 4:33 PM  

@18 Cataline Sergius
Prepare yourself for a devastating shock. The National Review's view wasn't any different.
----

National Review - with their glorious Never Trump issue, and their articles about white neighborhoods should just go ahead and die off.

Blogger Lovekraft April 19, 2017 4:34 PM  

Culture Present Day: Yet another barbaric attack on innocent westerner by the Islam.

Response from Left: nothing to see here.
Response from Right: let's meddle
Response from Alt-Right: someone has to pay
Response from Moderate: isn't there a ball game on?

Blogger Were-Puppy April 19, 2017 4:35 PM  

@37 A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents

"If only you two would sit down and have a beer together" is a phrase that I've come to loath. Not just because of 0bama's "beer summit", either.
---

Yeah really, if I was having a beer with one of these clowns i'd be tempted to shotgun it and crunch it flat on their head :P

Anonymous VFM #7916 April 19, 2017 4:45 PM  

@70

Read Victoria. Go to www.traditionalright.com.

The alternative to self-segregation is segregation by warfare.

Blogger Student in Blue April 19, 2017 4:47 PM  

What I'm trying to figure out is how the Alt-Right position could work out in the USA without some sort of exterminatory bloodbath.

If you a-fear for yourself and the only perceived safety is within your own, then people will start moving of their own volition.

Think of it like Operation Wetback, or the "Syrian" "immigration" crisis - did they move because they had physical guns put to their heads, or because they feared violence might happen?

Anonymous Red Cabbage April 19, 2017 4:53 PM  

@75 Thanks for the link.
@76 So, escalation to the edge of violence, to encourage people to move along?

Blogger American Spartan April 19, 2017 4:57 PM  

Red Cabbage wrote:Another moderate woman here. Well, I like reading Vox, so not THAT moderate.

I'm pretty sure that integration is against my interests, but I'm still for it. Mostly because I know so many blacks and native Americans whose ancestors have been here as long as mine have. (I'm your typical American white chick: English, Irish, smattering of indigenous.)

How can I advocate kicking them out? Where would they go?


Because, if you do not advocate removing them, they will out number, out vote you, your kids, robbing of them of their nation, culture, rights, wealth, and future.

They are advocating for their kids, why wont you advocate for your own?

Blogger Heian-kyo Dreams April 19, 2017 4:58 PM  

@77 Sometimes the escalation isn't a front, it's organic. Either way, yeah, people will move. A prime example of this is white flight. Dysfunctional blacks make the neighborhood dangerous enough that whites who aren't victims of any crime voluntarily move.

Anonymous Red Cabbage April 19, 2017 5:00 PM  

@78 I have a serious disease which would cause deformities in my children, so I have none for whom to advocate.

I do have beloved nieces and nephews, and I think of them often. Still not sure a genocidal bloodbath would be in their favor.

Anonymous Daniel H April 19, 2017 5:03 PM  

>> Alt-Right memelord weekend warrior Trump supporters

Weekend warrior is no slur.

The great foot soldiers of the old Roman Republic were weekend warriors. During the week they worked their farms, managed their shops, toiled at their craft, pastured their goats. When the call came, though, to defend their country, the Republic, their families, their liberty, the devoted citizens that they were, with pride and determination, put down their work tools, donned their armour, mustered on the field of Mars and went off to annihilate their enemy. When the fighting was done, they didn't look for glory, attention, pay, etc.... they simply returned to their fields and shops and picked up where they left off. Some weekend warriors, heh?

Blogger Heian-kyo Dreams April 19, 2017 5:05 PM  

@80 That's why the alt-right exists, to save beloved children. Some are at the point they're ready to say, "yes, I'll fight for their lives if I have to. It's better to fight than to watch them die."

Saying something now before it's a hot war will save more lives. You'll have to get over "being nice" to do so.

Anonymous Red Cabbage April 19, 2017 5:09 PM  

@82 Good point. Food for thought. Thank you.

(I'm a slow thinker but I get there eventually.)

Blogger Buybuydandavis April 19, 2017 5:15 PM  

One side was fighting to shut down speech, one side was fighting to defend it.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents April 19, 2017 5:16 PM  

UC Berkeley reaccomodates Coulter speech on the grounds of "safety".

"UC-Berkeley, a publicly-funded university, first imposed a series of ridiculous requirements on the speech allegedly in the name of ‘safety.’ Coulter, we were informed, would be required to deliver her speech in the afternoon; only students would be allowed to attend; and the speech location would not be announced until close to the event,” they continued. “Against our advice, Coulter agreed to all these requirements. In return, she requested two measures, which actually had something to do with safety.”

1) That the University of California chancellor request that the Oakland chief of police refrain from telling his men to stand down and ignore law-breaking by rioters attempting to shut down conservative speakers, as he has done in the past; and

2) That UC-Berkeley announce in advance that any students engaging in violence, mayhem or heckling to prevent an invited speaker from speaking would be expelled.

As Coulter explained, “If Berkeley wants to have free speech, it can have it.”

The university’s response was to ban her speech.


This is very clarifying. Coulter may speak at some other venue. Probably with some good security.

Anonymous Ominous Cowherd April 19, 2017 5:18 PM  

Red Cabbage wrote:. Mostly because I know so many blacks and native Americans whose ancestors have been here as long as mine have. ... How can I advocate kicking them out? Where would they go?

What does any of that have to do with anything? It doesn't matter what you or anyone advocate, either. We all know people who ``aren't like that.'' If they have to go away, I'll be sad and I'll miss them. Reality doesn't care about our feelings.

Anonymous Red Cabbage April 19, 2017 5:24 PM  

@86 "What does that have to do with anything?"

Because it's creepy to advocate pushing Americans into the sea. I'm not ready to go all "invasion of Canaan."

Blogger Heian-kyo Dreams April 19, 2017 5:42 PM  

@87 La Raza advocates pushing whites into the sea.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents April 19, 2017 5:44 PM  

@87 Red Cabbage

Don't confuse a prediction with a prescription.
Many people predicted some sort of war in Yugoslavia in the 1980's, that didn't mean they wanted the Bosnia war or the disaster of Sarajevo. They were just looking at a situation and saying, "Once Tito croaks, this and that will happen". Forced integration hasn't worked out the way it was supposed to. Diversity plus proximity equals war. Even science now admits that.

Anonymous A Deplorable Paradigm Is More Than Twenty Cents April 19, 2017 5:47 PM  

@88
It's different when they do it. Just ask them.

Blogger Heian-kyo Dreams April 19, 2017 5:52 PM  

@90 Definitely some white == whipping boy going around in these times.

Blogger Student in Blue April 19, 2017 5:53 PM  

@77. Red Cabbage
So, escalation to the edge of violence, to encourage people to move along?

As Heian-kyo Dreams said, "Sometimes the escalation isn't a front, it's organic."

And really, predictions of homogeneous societies is an understanding that these things will happen, not that we're necessarily the ones to do them.

After all, what happens if they really do wipe out all the cisgendered white men in the US? That's certainly a way of progressing towards a more homogeneous society. It'd also be a much worse society by almost every metric too.

As it is, short term our tactics are simply to state what we believe in, and to defend ourselves when our crazy enemies try to start something. They're gladly whipping everyone up into a fearful state as it is.

Anonymous jOHN MOSBY April 19, 2017 6:12 PM  

18. Cataline Sergius
Talk about hittin' the nail on the head. Excellent post, sir.

Anonymous Red Cabbage April 19, 2017 6:31 PM  

I get the idea that some sort of doom is inevitable. Really just trying to figure out (as you say) the difference between prediction and advocacy. I suppose the Alt-Right itself is working that out.

Thanks again for the thoughtful responses, gentlemen. And now, off to dinner.

Anonymous johnc April 19, 2017 6:37 PM  

@29 In my experience this is how American Jews handle disputes. Call a cop, file a lawsuit, kvetch and moan.

Well yeah... because they want to win. And they won't back down until they get their way. We should learn from them.

OT, but has anybody else noticed that when Christian morality and Jewish morality come into conflict, that one side consistently gets the laws changed to reflect their own side?
Divorce
Abortion
Porn
Everything.


Exactly. *Everything.* They're in it to win it. When's the last time somebody on the right actually got a law changed that benefits them?

Anonymous JAG April 19, 2017 7:00 PM  

Red Cabbage wrote:
How can I advocate kicking them out? Where would they go?


Back.

Anonymous Grayman April 19, 2017 7:13 PM  

@red cabbage

What I'm trying to figure out is how the Alt-Right position could work out in the USA without some sort of exterminatory bloodbath

That's the most likely outcome.

Get rid of civil rights and HUB and MAYBE it could be done peacefully. Right now HUD acivly ships minorities into white communities and civil rights prevents communities from really doing anything about it.

History suggests it isn't done peacefully regardless of what any of the parties want.

Blogger Snidely Whiplash April 19, 2017 7:24 PM  

Red Cabbage wrote:Because it's creepy to advocate pushing Americans into the sea. I'm not ready to go all "invasion of Canaan."
Nobody here is advocating that. We are all trying to figure out how to avoid an exterminatory bloodbath. And the primary way to avoid the next Civil War will be re-segregation.

Blogger F.D. Stephens April 19, 2017 7:36 PM  

Great post. Spot on.

Anonymous Avalanche April 19, 2017 7:36 PM  

Red Cabbage wrote:
Mostly because I know so many blacks and native Americans whose ancestors have been here as long as mine have. ... How can I advocate kicking them out? Where would they go?

There is even an initialism for that: IKAGO. "I know a good one." The problem is -- even the *good* ones vote for, say, affirmative action (so your White relatives must give up THEIR college desires for someone with a much lower score -- who will get lots of scholarship money your relatives SHOULD qualify for, but won't be given. The "good" ones vote in the black mayors and city council members and police chiefs -- and not-so-suddenly -- it's Ferguson and Detroit!

And do you really mean: "they've been here a long time so they should get to stay"? Native 'Americans' were NOT Americans -- there was no such thing as America when they had this fantastic continent to themselves; there were just tribes who warred against each other and were unable to join together to fight off the arrival of invaders who BUILT America! "America" did not exist until the (mostly) British settlers came here and BUILT IT! (America is fast disappearing under waves and waves of invaders who cannot be Americans - or they would have made their own version OF America in their own countries. (It's not like we have not given huge amounts of info and support to ANY nation that wishes to create their own version.) No - they ALL want to come here where they can live off what OUR forebears gave their sweat and blood, lives and deaths to create: OUR country. They have not "right" to this.

(You're looking at the nice few you know -- and ignoring the huge numbers who are NOT nice. Your nephews and nieces will lose their places -- and their country -- unless we succeed. Yes, it's hard and harsh to say to people: You must go back. But they MUST GO BACK!)

Blogger VD April 19, 2017 7:50 PM  

I do have beloved nieces and nephews, and I think of them often. Still not sure a genocidal bloodbath would be in their favor.

You're missing the point. The Alt-Right solutions of a) kicking them out or b) partition and segregation are the two realistic alternatives to c) the genocidal bloodbath.

We are hoping to avoid (c). Those attempting to stop (a) and (b) are working for (c), whether they realize it or not.

Blogger James Dixon April 19, 2017 8:04 PM  

> I get the idea that some sort of doom is inevitable.

Well, yeah. We all die. And every civilization in history has died within a certain time frame. Doom awaits us all, but individually and collectively. The question is how long we can delay it, not if it can be avoided.

Anonymous Blue Manticore April 19, 2017 8:21 PM  

VD wrote:I do have beloved nieces and nephews, and I think of them often. Still not sure a genocidal bloodbath would be in their favor.

You're missing the point. The Alt-Right solutions of a) kicking them out or b) partition and segregation are the two realistic alternatives to c) the genocidal bloodbath.

We are hoping to avoid (c). Those attempting to stop (a) and (b) are working for (c), whether they realize it or not.


What background ethical theory does Vox or others who accept this understanding (choosing the lesser of two unpalatable choices + rejecting ‘noble defeat’) of the Alt.Right endorse? I ask since, as has come up a few times on John Wright’s blog, any non-Consequentialist ethical account is going to lead to ‘hard cases’ (e.g. letting a large number of people die rather than sacrificing an innocent few to prevent it). If a person’s 'neutral'* stance leads to unpleasant situations for them as the first few posters indicate then, if morally motivated, that person will just have to bite the bullet.

*quotes because 'neutrality' might here mean opposition to both.

Blogger Dire Badger April 19, 2017 8:22 PM  

@102- actually the question is how we will recover from it.

Anonymous Blue Manticore April 19, 2017 8:31 PM  

American Spartan wrote:Red Cabbage wrote:Another moderate woman here. Well, I like reading Vox, so not THAT moderate.

I'm pretty sure that integration is against my interests, but I'm still for it. Mostly because I know so many blacks and native Americans whose ancestors have been here as long as mine have. (I'm your typical American white chick: English, Irish, smattering of indigenous.)

How can I advocate kicking them out? Where would they go?


Because, if you do not advocate removing them, they will out number, out vote you, your kids, robbing of them of their nation, culture, rights, wealth, and future.

They are advocating for their kids, why wont you advocate for your own?


OT from my other point but couldn't the same reasoning apply to those who vote in favor of detrimental political agendas? Who cares if X is a pure blooded scion of founding stock if they're a raging Communist hellbent on destroying culture, history and way of life?

(Here the Alt.Right race theorist might bite back by saying that if society was sorted on these ground it would end up as premierly of a certain ethnic stock anyway)

Anonymous User April 19, 2017 8:41 PM  

Vox, in your estimation how many sigma above mean intelligence must a person be to reliably distinguish predicting outcomes from advocating for them?

Blogger tz April 19, 2017 9:07 PM  

@103 - Just War theory applied to the immigration invasion

According to the Catechism, all of the following criteria must be met at the same time in order for a war to be considered just:

• the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain;

• all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective;

• there must be serious prospects of success;

• the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated.


All points should be clear by now. The Cuckservatives will attempt to fudge point 2 by coming up with examples that they will refuse to actually implement or have been shown not to work or are counterproductive (Would Jeb! do deportation or amnesty?).

#3 and #4 are critical points in that the clock was running out - 4 years of Hillary would have made success very difficult (without mass casulties).

@105 pure blooded scion of founding stock if they're a raging Communist hellbent on destroying culture, history and way of life?

They are a tiny minority, and other than the crazy uncle professor with tenure, they would not be significant. They only have power because they open the city gates to let in the barbarians. Also since they are generally sterile or below "replacement" that bloodline would end soon enough.

Blogger tz April 19, 2017 9:36 PM  

@63 I'm pretty sure that integration is against my interests, but I'm still for it. Mostly because I know so many blacks and native Americans whose ancestors have been here as long as mine have. ...
How can I advocate kicking them out? Where would they go?

Integration is NOT related to civil rights - and violates free association. Go back and read what happened in the late 1960's with forced cross-town busing for racial integration. White flight. You want more of that at gunpoint?

Native Americans are already on reservations, and can stay and get a visa for a visit. But we have to stop the welfare payments so they can decide how they can do something productive instead of mooching. Your point about "generations" also means they have had time to fix things. My grandparents had nothing to do with creating the situation, so why should I be forced to pay for it or otherwise deal with the consequences.

As to Blacks, they are already going to prison, for actual crimes, or for not paying child support. Their families may have been here longer than mine, but 4th generation welfare bastards that become gang members? Feel free to "Integrate" into Detroit or Chicago if you are so hellbent on doing so.

Going back to the 1960s, though we still had segregation, blacks were playing by western civilization rules and each generation acted more civilized - fewer out of wedlock births, savings, taking care of property, etc. I can wish to return to that, but you can't unshatter a mirror and that is the state of the Black family. And I have no solution - the wound is too deep, the cancer is too advanced. Sometimes one school gets some kind of principal with teachers that enforce discipline, and the children start returning to the earlier state, but it is often discarded with the next school, even when peer pressure from outside doesn't deride virtue and knowledge.

Instead of desiring integration, you should start the long generational process of turning today's black children back to western civilization.

That isn't diversity, it isn't even integration, but it is possible to create a high-trust low-time preference society, and that is the only way we can avoid deportation or quarantine. Prisons are a soft quarantine and deportation.

Blogger Cail Corishev April 19, 2017 9:51 PM  

Vox, in your estimation how many sigma above mean intelligence must a person be to reliably distinguish predicting outcomes from advocating for them?

It's a consistent problem, isn't it? Sometimes it's an attempt to trap the target into saying something that sounds like advocacy; but there have been several lately that genuinely seem to be confusing "I predict this" with "I want this" or "I'm trying to cause this." I don't know if it's a question of intelligence; I suspect high-IQ sperges struggle with it.

Maybe it's because modern society is so immersed in New Age-y, wishful-thinking thinking, so people are used to the idea that if you don't want something to happen, you don't think about it -- you think about happy alternatives instead. If you have cancer, you're not supposed to think about cancer; you're supposed to think about health and happiness. So if you're thinking (and talking) about civil war and genocide, people assume you must want it to happen on some level.

Blogger Matthew April 19, 2017 10:34 PM  

Cail Corishev wrote:It's a consistent problem, isn't it? Sometimes it's an attempt to trap the target into saying something that sounds like advocacy; but there have been several lately that genuinely seem to be confusing "I predict this" with "I want this" or "I'm trying to cause this." I don't know if it's a question of intelligence; I suspect high-IQ sperges struggle with it.

No, it's a question of whether you're willing to commit to winning. Will you put your children ahead of other people?

It is that simple.

Blogger Matthew April 19, 2017 10:37 PM  

High-IQ types tend to privilege their ideas over their families. This is stupid.

Blogger Student in Blue April 19, 2017 11:41 PM  

@109. Cail Corishev
I don't know if it's a question of intelligence; I suspect high-IQ sperges struggle with it.

I don't believe it's a question of intelligence, but there may be some correlation. What's happening is when someone runs into something rhetorically unpalatable, do they respond rationally, or emotionally? Because when it's emotionally, then it becomes a personal question, but if it's rationally then there's a chance they'll correctly read it to be in the abstract that it is.

But even intelligent people have their own emotional hang-ups, both large and small, and that's what trips them up if they don't account for it.

Blogger Student in Blue April 19, 2017 11:44 PM  

"rhetorically unpalatable" is probably the incorrect way to describe it. Instead it should've been something like, "concepts that demand response".

Blogger Glaivester April 19, 2017 11:53 PM  

You really should refer to him as Stephen L. Miller so people don't confuse him with Trump's advisor. It's like Charles Johnson (Little Green Footballs) and Charles C. Johnson (GotNews).

Blogger James Dixon April 20, 2017 11:38 AM  

> @102- actually the question is how we will recover from it.

That question was answered just a few days ago, on Easter Sunday.

> ...in your estimation how many sigma above mean intelligence must a person be to reliably distinguish predicting outcomes from advocating for them?

I've known below average people who understood it. And we've seen fairly intelligent people who don't. It doesn't seem to be entirely related to IQ.

Anonymous Red Cabbage April 20, 2017 12:16 PM  

You guys got it in one... I'm fairly smart but super spergy. Also, although I'm way off the charts in intuition, I'm not particularly logical. Well, we all do our best with what God gave us, don't we?

Alright, this is making more sense to me.
1) At this point, a decent person must respond to the Left.
2) The same decent response that would prevent catastrophe is also the one that ratchets up the situation.
3) Therefore any decent person has already chosen sides, all the way up to catastrophe. It's just a question of whether they know it or not yet.

Well that simplifies things. I shall wait upon God to show me my part in this.

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey April 20, 2017 12:17 PM  

@Cail Corishev

"Maybe it's because modern society is so immersed in New Age-y, wishful-thinking thinking, so people are used to the idea that if you don't want something to happen, you don't think about it -- you think about happy alternatives instead."

Probably related to the leftist propensity for utopian thinking, and to the extent to which the progressive narrative simply ignores reality. Since truth/ falsehood is an unimportant judgment compared to compatibility/ incompatibility with the narrative, mentioning hatefacts necessarily means that you are a hater. It does seem to be a recurrent problem.

https://infogalactic.com/info/Moralistic_fallacy

Blogger Francis Parker Yockey April 20, 2017 12:23 PM  

@Matthew

"High-IQ types tend to privilege their ideas over their families. This is stupid."

Yep. Related: Bruce Charlton on "clever sillies":

http://medicalhypotheses.blogspot.com/2009/11/clever-sillies-why-high-iq-lack-common.html?m=1

"General intelligence is not just a cognitive ability; it is also a cognitive disposition. So, the greater cognitive abilities of higher IQ tend also to be accompanied by a distinctive high IQ personality type including the trait of ‘Openness to experience’, ‘enlightened’ or progressive left-wing political values, and atheism. Drawing on the ideas of Kanazawa, my suggested explanation for this association between intelligence and personality is that an increasing relative level of IQ brings with it a tendency differentially to over-use general intelligence in problem-solving, and to over-ride those instinctive and spontaneous forms of evolved behaviour which could be termed common sense. Preferential use of abstract analysis is often useful when dealing with the many evolutionary novelties to be found in modernizing societies; but is not usually useful for dealing with social and psychological problems for which humans have evolved ‘domain-specific’ adaptive behaviours. And since evolved common sense usually produces the right answers in the social domain; this implies that, when it comes to solving social problems, the most intelligent people are more likely than those of average intelligence to have novel but silly ideas, and therefore to believe and behave maladaptively."

Blogger Flair1239 April 20, 2017 2:09 PM  

These are the same types that say "people are people"... meanwhile they keep moving further and further away from the cities to avoid ya know "those people"

Anonymous Blue Manticore April 21, 2017 7:06 AM  

tz wrote:@103 - Just War theory applied to the immigration invasion

According to the Catechism, all of the following criteria must be met at the same time in order for a war to be considered just:

• the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain;

• all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective;

• there must be serious prospects of success;

• the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated.


All points should be clear by now. The Cuckservatives will attempt to fudge point 2 by coming up with examples that they will refuse to actually implement or have been shown not to work or are counterproductive (Would Jeb! do deportation or amnesty?).

#3 and #4 are critical points in that the clock was running out - 4 years of Hillary would have made success very difficult (without mass casulties).

@105 pure blooded scion of founding stock if they're a raging Communist hellbent on destroying culture, history and way of life?

They are a tiny minority, and other than the crazy uncle professor with tenure, they would not be significant. They only have power because they open the city gates to let in the barbarians. Also since they are generally sterile or below "replacement" that bloodline would end soon enough.


Baring the Turkey proposals many immigrants don't have the intention of invading/performing an act of war-fare though (the intention being of course what separates accidentally causing a death and committing murder), so one can't count their actions as such.

Granted in the case of illegals of them having knowingly breached a nation's laws and are thus subject to penalty and potential use of force if they resist. That would legitimise deporting them on non-Consequential grounds.

The use of force against those who have immigrated legally (even if the laws had bad consequences) wouldn't be justified on these grounds however. If there's any moral guilt there on Aristotelean ethical lines it lies with the law-makers who've made imprudent decisions.

Re Communists, at the present time in history maybe (what percentage of home-grown Millennials are SJW inclined?) but societies still had big problems with Communist and other anti-correct value movements before diversity.

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